WF Premier2 ATV 4.5ton HELP

Discussion in 'Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by geo_jon, Jan 24, 2012.

  1. Mark Custis

    Mark Custis Not soon. Industry Professional Forum Leader

    I recommend that all of my tinkering customers buy a usable electric multimeter and a clamp on amp meter. If they get into the better test instrument they usually get a free digital thermometer with the purchase.
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2012
  2. geo_jon

    geo_jon New Member

    Have ran an amp test on the pumps. Breaking the incoming black wire to the pump and inserting an amp meter.

    The first pump in the sequence is the pump between the field and the water out line on the furnace. This pump is drawing 0.90A at 220v

    The second pump (which is activated after entering 2nd stage) is between the field and the water in on the furnace, is drawing 0.94A at 220v
     
  3. Mark Custis

    Mark Custis Not soon. Industry Professional Forum Leader

    OK

    The wires to those pumps are both "HOT" so you only looked at one side of what is happening electrically.

    Look at the LRA rating on the manufacturers tag on the pump and compare it to your readings. If the numbers on the pump are close to the numbers you saw then the pump is doing work.

    How much work depends. If the pumps are in a push/pull flow center then you should have three way valves that will allow you to take the pumps out of the system. You want to inspect the impellers for fouling agents, IE gunk.

    You are brave enough to try this stuff so I keep feeding you. (Note to self: Check with Liability Carrier about on line consultations),

    I still think your heat-X is scaled or plugged, but lets take the pumps out of the diagnostics.
     
  4. geo_jon

    geo_jon New Member

    Faceplate on the Grundfos UP26-99F says 1.07A.

    You are right, the Flowcenter is a push/pull configuration and there is a 3 way valve just
    above the pumps (between the pumps and the field). I can configure it to seal the field and open only to purge ports and furnace. I'm sure there will be a little water lost and this would mean purging the lines again (just preparing for what is to come). I have purged the system before but have never taken the pumps apart. Online docs state that you can remove the 4 screws on the face of the pump, pull the cover, and the rotor/impeller assembly will just come out. So far, I'm ok with this procedure.

    Few questions. Is it very common for an impeller to get "gunked"? I have had shallow well pump impellers crack and cause low flow, but have not seen one gunked. What about re-assembly? Am I going to need a new gasket or anything to put it back together? This is wintertime and despite the inefficiency of the unit, I might be hard pressed to do without it.
     
  5. Mark Custis

    Mark Custis Not soon. Industry Professional Forum Leader

    I like being warm, too

    I would not have you take apart any plumbing project when the hardware store is closed.

    What I am up to is I think that the co-ax is clogged or you have stuff growing in your loops. Do not ask me why I think this it is just because I do this for a living.

    I feel your pain. I do this because I like it and just get heat transfer.

    Mark
    440.223.0840
     
  6. WF_Inc

    WF_Inc Member

    geo_jon,

    We have reviewed your website, as well as your posts; unfortunately, we still do not have enough information. We would suggest you contact a WaterFurnace dealer or HVAC contractor to have them verify the CFM and water flow.
     
  7. geo_jon

    geo_jon New Member

    I guess it is not obvious from the URL posted, but the CFM is set (via dipswitches) at the default 1500cfm (on high). Switches are 1/5/10 on SW2.

    gpm flow has not been confirmed, although seems everyone agrees that it is lower than the expected 12gpm. cfm has also not been confirmed, only to say that the furnace is
    "set to" 1500cfm on high speed.
     
  8. Mark Custis

    Mark Custis Not soon. Industry Professional Forum Leader

    Jon

    Do not call for the purge cart yet.

    There are work arounds just like computers and old V-8 engines. Some of us know them some of us do not. Randy and I designed a add to the system system that eliminates purge cart trips to his home. We did this by email. He is good at piping.

    My M/O is limited to my 3/4 HP pool pump, so I set up my systems to be self repairing. I try and keep all piping joints available to my hands so that fittings may be tightened. Randy knew he had a small leak so when we changed out his heat pump on Christmas eve day we knew we needed more.

    I knew how to add chemicals to boilers with out dropping the system and together we designed a simple system that he uses to add fluid to the loops. I have drawings and pictures. What happens is we load a dispersal tank with antifreeze at 100% and feed it to the loops as needed as if, (which it is), a normal hydronic system.

    Sooooooo.

    If a system is set up like a normal hydronics system, then we can add fluid as needed without a giant purge cart. The system will extract air, suspended air and entrapped air all by itself. We need to replace the eliminated air with fluid however.

    I do not think the industry standard push pull flow center is the best practice for geothermal loop systems. I have said this for years here and at other industry BB sites. I do not like the industry standard idea that air goes away if you boost the loop pressure, it goes into suspention. I did not care about all of this until the tax credit, now everyone is in on the geo stage and making more systems than ever that do not work. They do not work for all the wrong reasons.

    Jon:

    Your system is old enough to be replaced or at least upgraded. I recomend that you do either with great care and insight. The money you will save is yours.

    Mark
     

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