Waterless vertical loop or waterfurnace horizontal loop?

Discussion in 'Geothermal Loops' started by HHarpel, Jan 12, 2013.

  1. HHarpel

    HHarpel New Member

    Hi, Im new and completely clueless. Im gonna build a 2100 sf house and trying to decide whether to use advanced geothermal technologys waterless vertical loop (WELCOME - ADVANCED GEOTHERMAL TECHNOLOGY) or go with waterfurnaces 5 series with a horizontal loop, the installer said the waterfurnace loop would be buried 4 feet down while the vertical loop installers said it would be down 65 feet with copper pipes vs a type of plastic for the horizontal loop. Which loop type is better and any feedback on the waterless system would be appreciated. I'm building in Bellefontaine, OH.
     
  2. Mark Custis

    Mark Custis Not soon. Industry Professional Forum Leader

    Hi, and welcome.

    It is interesting to me that the DX guys have re-named themselves water less loops.

    I have been doing geothermal systems in Ohio since Jimmy Carter was President. Every DX system I have seen or worked on does not hold up in Ohio soil, it is too acidic. If you want a system that will out live you I would say stick with pex or HDPE loops. I think most here would agree.

    If you use plastic loops with water why limit to one manufacturer?

    You are well within our area of operation so if I can help you with your project let me know.

    Mark
     
  3. docjenser

    docjenser Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    DX system either fail relatively soon (in NY state at least) or work very inefficient. There is really nothing advanced there. But I am sure it sounds great for marketing. Horizontal water loops should be between 5-8 feet, but it does not have to be Waterfurnace (although the 5 series is a nice reliable unit). There is no performance advantage of vertical versus horizontal. The plastic HDPE pipes are much more reliable than the copper pipes, and much longer lasting, that is why they are used.
     
  4. HHarpel

    HHarpel New Member

    ok, so from what I'm reading, a waterless loop system is a DX system, thats why I could find NO info on the waterless geo system. Wow! From what I've read very few people recommended them and most said when they break it is very costly to repair vs a water based system. Any recommendations besides the waterfurnace 5 deries? The guy told me this is the best of the best for geothermal. If I go with the Waterfurnace 5 series, the loop should be buried at least 5 feet? The installer told me 4 feet. Any recommendations for geo installers for a new construction build in Bellefontaine, OH (Logan county)
     
  5. Calladrilling

    Calladrilling Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    Wow! That good marketing "waterless geothermal". Sounds very exciting.
    I would still recommended the the newest technology "fire-free" geothermal systems though. They are very reliable since they are installed with HDPE and use a Eco friendly heat transferring antifreeze.
    You do not have to limited to Water Furnace though, try Climate master, Bosch, etc...
    There is more than options than just horizontal too ( vertical, horizontal, pond , and open loops).
     
  6. Mark Custis

    Mark Custis Not soon. Industry Professional Forum Leader

    I want loops to be at least a foot deeper than the required local regulations for footer depth. The length per ton depends on the dirt. We did a system in Greene County at an average of 7 feet that works very well.

    I tend to educate my customers so that they can make the hard choices. Are you looking for a turn key project or DIY, maybe a combination of the two?

    Who's machine to buy is not as important as the design and installation. The delivery system will dictate the type of machine to buy.

    The first thing you will need is a heat loss/gain calculation.

    Mark

    Mark
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2013

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