Waterfurnace Series 7 Energy Use

Discussion in 'Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by josephparris, Dec 3, 2012.

  1. docjenser

    docjenser Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    350W sounds like the flowcenter. Check if the pump is on. I assume you have single magma pump for loop circulation.
  2. josephparris

    josephparris Member


    Do you have a way to just monitor the wattage usuage of the Series 7 by itself? Not through the AID port with the AID tool, but with a CT (current transducer) on the circuit for that unit,
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2013
  3. dmj2359

    dmj2359 New Member

    I do. I'm currently utilizing 4/4 allowed current sensors on my TED system, setup as follows:

    1. Panel A, Whole House
    2. Panel B, Whole House
    3. Panel A, HVAC circuit (Compressor + Fan)
    4. Panel B, HVAC Circuit (Aux Heat + Loop Pump) + electric water heater

    I'm going to rerun and post some standby numbers but we hit a cold snap in Maryland and it hasn't shut off in a few days. With temperatures hitting single digits at night I don't want to shut it down for an hour to check. I should have something Monday-ish.

    350W would sound about right for the loop pump, especially if it's running wide open. Mine is pretty quiet but if you put your hand on it you can feel it running. Alternatively I'm still suspicious that something else is hanging off the HVAC branch circuit (is there 1 or 2 circuits supplying your system?) that is still running.
  4. Palace GeoThermal

    Palace GeoThermal Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    you can tell if the loop pump is running by taking the large screw off of the face of the motor, this exposes the end of the shaft. A little water might leak out, don't worry about this. Insert a small screw driver in the hole. If the pump is running, you will feel the vibration with the screw driver. We do this all of the time, so don't worry about doing any damage
  5. engineer

    engineer Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    350 Watts sounds like a loop pump is continuously running.

    The control circuits (thermostats, zone board, dampers, sensors, etc) should use no more than 10-20 Watts. (Mine - Intellizone with 4 zones) uses 12 Watts when nothing is going on. Blower adds 50 Watts to that while in "G" mode (lowest CFM / speed)
  6. dmj2359

    dmj2359 New Member

    I've been working with Joseph via email to figure out the root of the problem, and as it turns out, there isn't one. The current measurement he is taking is using a current clamp, and is therefore measuring apparent power only. He received this info direct from WaterFurnace:

    I verified this via my TED measurements (which accounts for power factor corrections). The measured power factor of the compressor circuit in standby is 0.069 for my system. My thermostat indicates that the system is using 13-40 watts in standby, which is roughly what my TED says. When running compressor speed 6, fan speed 7 Joseph's and my system indicate ~1585 watts via the thermostat and ~1460 via my TED measurements. Joseph also verified that the system was drawing closer to 30 watts by shutting off everything in the house but the WaterFurnace and monitoring his electric meter.

    If anyone has any follow-up questions or would like some additional data points let me know.
  7. WF_Inc

    WF_Inc Member

    We are unsure who josephparris spoke with at WaterFurnace; however, we have reviewed this information with our engineering staff and have confirmed that the explanation above regarding apparent power vs. real power is correct.
  8. WF_Inc

    WF_Inc Member


    We have read your comments regarding the IntelliZone2 thermostat resetting. We are interested in looking into this further. Could you please provide the model and serial numbers of your unit, as well as the name of the contractor you are working with? Please feel free to send us a private message if you do not wish to post this information publicly.
  9. JFLame

    JFLame Member

    The dealer just updated my Intellizone2 thermostat to v1.05 today. This version fixes the energy monitoring issues we've reported in this thread.

    I'm happy to say they've fixed the metrics. Now the daily monitoring reports out:

    Avg OAT
    Avg Cooling KW
    Avg Heating KW
    Total KWh
    Run Time Hours

    All of these are now reported with a single decimal as well. So far they seem to be accurate.

    Nice job Waterfurnace. Keep the updates coming.
  10. josephparris

    josephparris Member

    Hmmmm......my dealer told me two days ago that he had received the update, but WF asked for it back because it had a flaw, so he sent the update back to WF.

    Now I am confused!
  11. dmj2359

    dmj2359 New Member

    My system was installed in October 2012 and shipped with v1.05 on the IntelliZone2 thermostat. The daily metrics have always been correct for me in this version - but the monthly summaries are still wrong. For example my thermostat shows 0.8 kW/h average in heating for the month of January, and 0.2 kW/h average for cooling. I know for a fact that the system has never entered cooling mode since system checkout in October, let alone contributed 20% of my energy costs for January...in Maryland...where we're having a cold winter...

  12. JFLame

    JFLame Member

    I'll have to check my version again. The version I just got is different than what I had, and mine was just installed in December. This is supposed to address the inaccurate reporting of the cooling use, which I did see reflected in the monthly totals.
  13. dmj2359

    dmj2359 New Member

    Actually, I will stand corrected - mine is running v1.04 currently. I confused it with a version number for another, unrelated piece of equipment.
  14. josephparris

    josephparris Member

    Getting my software update today for my series 7 WF. There is one for the thermostat and one for the unit itself. I will report the changes when I can.

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