Unit Replacement - WaterFurnace or ClimateMaster

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Paul Westbrook, Jan 10, 2019.

  1. Paul Westbrook

    Paul Westbrook New Member

    I have a 22+ year old WaterFurnace Premier2 Geothermal HVAC system. The coil developed a pinhole leak and I'm deciding on coil replacement or total unit replacement.

    Current Setup
    WaterFurnace Premier2 - 1996 installation
    Model: ATV045
    I have (4) closed loop geothermal shafts of 220’ each.
    Pumps:
    (2) Grundfos 99 Geo-Flo
    Type: UP26-99F
    Power: 245 W

    2 Zone System (upstairs / downstairs)
    Controller: Honeywell HZ322 TrueZONE
    TSTATS: (2) Ecobee Smart Si
    Dampers: (2) Honeywell M847D1004

    The zone controller board was replaced in 2014 along with the new T-stats. I would prefer to keep those instead of replace them again. I also replaced one of the Grundfos pumps recently and would probably keep that pump pair in place.

    My existing unit runs about 85% of the time in low speed mode. It only kicks to high speed when coming out of a temperature setback or on the absolute hottest or coldest days. 2700 square foot passive solar home with SIP walls/roof (very airtight with good insulation).
    Summary Cooling Heating
    Load Total 27999 26622

    I'm in the process of getting quotes for a WaterFurnace and ClimateMaster unit. For the WF Series 5 it appears the 038 dual speed model would be adequate for my home. For the CM, the TE 30 series (TE-038) should work well. I like the efficiency of higher end units, but I have a very efficient home and it might not be worth the cost delta. My total heating/cooling energy for 2017 was only 2,476kWh (~$250/year).

    So my question is about reliability and longevity expectations of WF Series 5 vs. CM TE 30. I've talked to one supplier who carries both and he said the drain pain in the WF has needed replacement often and CM is using stainless (no issues). Another supplier said they had some issues with CM units and switched to WF. This might be a case where either will be good, but I'm looking for any data or points to sway me in either direction. My house site is https://enerjazz.com/house
     
  2. docjenser

    docjenser Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    We have about 1,100 Waterfurnace and Climatemaster units installed, and never had an issue with a drain pan in either one of them. We switched over to WF about 7 years ago.

    If you are using a 3 ton unit, you could save significant pumping power to have only (1) 26-99 installed.

    A 3 ton 5 series will use about 1100 watts when operating in 1st stage, but you are using about 450 watts for pumping.....
     
  3. Paul Westbrook

    Paul Westbrook New Member

    Thanks for your response. One quote came in just 28 minutes ago and recommended exactly that - switch to a single pump with a WaterFurnace Series 5. That's the right size unit for my load and the single pump will help make it even more efficient. I have one more supplier coming out Monday morning. Getting close to an upgraded system and feeling comfortable with either WF or CM. It will be price and confidence in installer making my choice. Photo is my current system energy use during an extremely hot day in July. One of the few times it kicked into high speed mode. [​IMG]
     
  4. Paul Westbrook

    Paul Westbrook New Member

    I got 3 bids - two WF and one CM. The two suppliers who seemed very competent have very similar prices. One is CM and one is WF. I basically have two good choices and it will be tough to pick, but that's a good problem.

    I do have one option on the CM - the internal variable speed pump. Does anyone have experience with the internal pump? The base option is to use my existing Grundfos 26-99 fixed speed pump. Any thoughts on the internal variable pump? Should save some additional energy but I'm wondering about reliability.
     
  5. docjenser

    docjenser Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    I prefer to have the water circulation pump outside the cabinet, not a few inches away from the control board.....WF should have a variable circulation pump, too.
    I know that, ...since I put one in every time I put a geo system in.....;)
     
  6. Paul Westbrook

    Paul Westbrook New Member

    Thanks for the inputs. I've decided to go with the WF unit and leave my existing pump operating outside the cabinet. We're going to reuse one of my existing pumps (I currently have 2 pumps for the 2 ton / 4 ton unit and we'll only need one for the 2 ton / 3 ton replacement). In the future I can replace that pump with a variable speed pump after the one I already own, and the spare I'll keep as backup, finally dies.
     
  7. docjenser

    docjenser Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    Sounds like a plan....
     

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