Quebec Disconnect a pump?

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Lyra, Dec 9, 2018.

  1. Lyra

    Lyra New Member

    Hi,

    Had geothermal installed in may of this year - everything seems to be working well so far!

    I was wondering if I perhaps had too much flow, and would be better off, on an efficiency standpoint, to disconnect the second pump.

    • I have a Non Pressurized flow center, with 2x UP26-99U pumps
    • I have 4 wells, parallel, 145ft deep each, 3/4" pipe
    • Ethanol 30% (Geo-Flo)
    • WaterFurnace 5 Series NDV038
    • When they ran the tests with both pumps, they were actually off the charts and disconnected the second pump to get better readings. Here are the results (Tests were run mid September)
      • HEATING
        • Air: 73.4 in / 98.2 out
        • Fluid: 53.6 in / 46.9 out
        • Pressure: 11.9 in / 8.5 out
        • Flow (derived from pressure): 9 GPM
        • Compressor: 9.7A / 245V
      • COOLING
        • Air: 69.9 in / 50.5 out
        • Fluid: 65.1 in / 73.7 out
        • Pressure: 13.8 in / 10.2 out
        • Flow (derived from pressure): 9 GPM
        • Compressor: 7.5A / 245V
    Also, if consensus is to disconnect the pump, the wires are daisy-chained. I just disconnect the second pump and put electrical tape around it?
     
  2. docjenser

    docjenser Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    perfect example that 2 pump flowcenter are not needed in your application. Your were wasting upfront money and system efficiency.
     
  3. Lyra

    Lyra New Member

    Thankfully this was by far the cheapest quote, so though it could have been cheaper, it was fairly reasonable. I know cheaper isn't always better, but in this case it's a company that only does geo and some of the other quotes were absurd.

    So I take it your vote is on disconnecting the pump? Just pull the wires from it and isolate them?
     
  4. docjenser

    docjenser Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    Unfortunately it displays that your geo only company is not very evolved. Ofter, companies install 2 pump flow centers since they either do not own a purge cart, or they do not want to bring the purge cart out. So they install a 2 pump flow center, which has so much flow that it can purge out the air out of the loops.

    So it makes their life easier for a few minutes, and then you pay a price of literally doubling the pumping power for the next 20-30 years. But hey, it was cheap upfront....

    Enjoy your geo system! ;)
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2018
  5. Deuce

    Deuce Member

    Doc I have a similar set up, so would it make sense to disconnect the second pump? Thanks
     
  6. docjenser

    docjenser Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    better than keeping it connected.
    The word is still out wether it damages the disconnected pump to have water pumped through it. Some claim it does, including the manufacturers. What size system do you have again?
     
  7. Lyra

    Lyra New Member

    I have a 3 ton WaterFurnace 5 series.
     
  8. Deuce

    Deuce Member

    I have a 4 ton WF.
     
  9. docjenser

    docjenser Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    Both can easily operated by a single 26-99. a 3 ton only has 9 gpm nominally, with 4 parallel 290 ft loops the pressure drop is very low. 4 ton has more flow, Deuce what kind of loop field do you have?
     
  10. Deuce

    Deuce Member

    I have 6 vertical wells, 220’ deep because I also have a 2 ton unit with a separate single pump using the same wells.
     
  11. nc73

    nc73 Member Forum Leader

    I don't think their intention was to use it as to purge. More of a why not, the customer is the one paying for it and they didn't know how to calculate friction loss, etc. Can't you just turn the pump speed to low on both?

    edit: Just looked up the amp draw and even both at low, still draws about 2.6amp. Best to disconnect
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2018
    Lyra likes this.
  12. Lyra

    Lyra New Member

    I didn't see any way to turn down the speed, anyways. I think it's the single speed version of the 26-99?

    At worry, damaging the unused pump just means I won't be able to use it as a spare, right? In that case it's probably better to stop it anyways.

    I also saw in the Geo-Flo NP manual that it's possible to convery a single-pump flow center to a dual pump - I assume the opposite is also possible? It seems to show a blank plate (that I don't have) and would most likely introduce air, so not a DIY thing to do, but could be worth it if I eventually need to get the one running pump fixed.
     
  13. nc73

    nc73 Member Forum Leader

    Didn't realize it wasn't adjustable. I emailed B&D and they did say the pump can be removed and they sell a cover plate to replace it. I'll have to contact a local distributor for one.
     
  14. docjenser

    docjenser Well-Known Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    You can still operate the 4 ton with a single 26-99
     
  15. Lyra

    Lyra New Member

    Well, they had to come by for a small issue (antifreeze correction was in WELL mode instead of LOOP mode). They actually disconnected the pump themselves as they were surprised their tech had reconnected it after running the performance test and noticing the high flow.

    We'll see how performance goes over the winter! Thanks for the help. This is a great community.
     
  16. Deuce

    Deuce Member

    Will using a single pump (26 - 116) slow down the loop flow and increase performance?
     
  17. nc73

    nc73 Member Forum Leader

    decreasing flow does not increase performance. If you are running higher gpm than recommended, slowing down would save you pumping cost.
     
  18. Deuce

    Deuce Member

    i will restate my question; can having two pumps hurt performance by having too much (too fast) flow. I understand the performance cost of operating the second pump that is not needed.
     
  19. nc73

    nc73 Member Forum Leader

    You don't seem to understand this....yes it will increase performance, but it is tiny compared to the cost to run the second pump. You are wasting money. If you want to waste money, fine by us.
     
  20. mtrentw

    mtrentw Active Member Industry Professional Forum Leader

    Energy put into pumping will enter loops, ultimately as heat. If you run an additional 200 watts of pump, that turns into 200 watts of heat. Anytime you're pumping you'd effectively be running a small aux heater dumping into the loop to be recovered by the heat pump. More detrimental in cooling than heating.
     

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